The Truth Behind Objections and How to Handle Them Like a Pro

0:01 Welcome to The Coaching Equation brought to you by Empire Partners and hosted by Ryan Lang and Brooke Bishop. Our mission is to help you build a profitable and impactful coaching business by cutting through the noise and all the expert advice to deliver tried and true actionable insights that you can deploy in your business today. Each week, we bring on expert guests, unveil cutting edge tactics and strategies, and share the secrets and stories that we've gathered from working with the most successful coaching companies on earth. Welcome back to the Coaching Equation Podcast.

0:42 I'm your host, Ryan Lang, CEO and co-founder of Empire Partners, alongside my co-founder and co-host, Brooke Bishop. And if you've ever felt stuck when a prospect throws out an objection, This episode is going to be an absolute game changer for you because Brooke and I are breaking down the psychology behind objections, why they happen, what they actually mean, and how to handle them without feeling pushy or salesy. So if you've ever heard, I need to think about it. Now's not the right time. I need to talk to my spouse. The aliens ate my credit card and you weren't sure how to respond.

1:23 We've got you covered in this episode. This is all going to be around shifting your mindset around objections, building trust and leading conversations with confidence. Let's dive in. This is episode 41 of the Coaching Equation podcast. Welcome back to the Coaching Equation podcast. I'm your host, Ryan Lang, CEO and co-founder of Empire Partners, alongside my co-founder and co-host, Brooke Bishop. Yo, dude. What up, what up? All right. So today is going to be really insightful for a lot of people. And we're going to be talking objections today. And one of the key mistakes that we see people making with objections is that they're asking the wrong question to begin with.

2:12 Typically, the question in handling objections is, how do I handle the objection? What do I say? And I want to start this episode by probably knocking you on your head a little bit and telling you that you're asking the wrong question. So let's start with the right question as we start to understand objections in today's episode, which is, what are they really? And I love that you kicked it off that way, dude, because the quality of our questions is going to dictate the quality of our answers. Right. And so I think that when we think of objections, most of us go, we cringe, we collapse, we contract, we freak out.

2:57 We go, oh, I just want everybody to see the magic that is whatever the heck it is that I'm offering. And why are they giving me resistance? And we have... a lot of deep seated pieces as it relates to confrontation. Cause I think that that's what we really see objections as it's like, Oh no, now I have to do that thing that I'm petrified of doing. I have to confront. And when we think of confrontation, most people, especially as it relates to relationships, we have a lot of fear around that. Yeah. As it relates to people, we don't really know we have even more fear around it, which is crazy. Right? So what, What are they really? Where does this really come from? So we have to really crack into the world of psychology because what kicks into gear is we got fight or flight.

3:43 Yeah. Yeah. And if we go back, you know, a few thousand years ago, you know, we had saber, maybe more than a thousand years, but we had saber tooth tigers and we had, you know, wild animals that could kill us. And we had, you know, warring nations and all these things that were going on. And so our brain is literally hardwired to protect us. And so you fast forward a few thousand years. Well, now do we have saber tooth tigers? No. But now we have this other fun thing that's equally dangerous called judgment. Yeah. And our fear of that judgment is no different than, you know, a saber tooth tiger that's lingering over a ledge that's going to jump off and pounce on us. Yeah. And so we go into this space of going, oh, no, this feels uncomfortable.

4:25 This feels scary. This feels not normal. And so we get into this whole thing of if I, and I love the fact you brought this up because it's probably the most dominant thing we hear. What do I say? Just tell me the words. Just tell me the exact language as if like abracadabra. It's like this like language thing that if you just drop abracadabra, it fixes every single thing that will ever come up with every single person. And it's just not true. Yeah, here's your objection handling. Here's your rebuttal handbook. Abracadabra, supercalifragilisticexpialidocious.

5:07 There you go. Every time. Works every time like a charm. You know, one of the things that I want to mention about the whole thing on fight or flight is that – There's so much that can be wrapped up in that fight or flight moment. It can be judgment. It can also be literally so often we miss the boat on what's really going on inside of people. And so often we think that an objection is actually them saying – no, or I don't think I want this, or I don't like you, or I don't trust you, etc.

5:51 And you're so right in that moment, it can be judgment. It also can be literally, they could be saying literally the opposite. Oh my God, this is everything I've been asking for. This is everything I've been looking for. This is the moment I finally get to fix this problem. And guess what? If they've got a problem that's big enough for you to help them fix it, they've been in a pattern and a way of, you know, acting or not acting or behavior for some time now and their brain is conditioned to it. And so in that moment, if they legitimately believe that there's a chance they could fix this.

6:34 It is fight or flight. The brain just going, whoa, time out. Like, stop. Danger, Will Robinson. Like, get us the hell out of here. Tell him the dog ate your homework or some shit. Like, aliens came down and stole your credit card. You know, I got to drive back to my office to get my credit. That's one of my favorite ones. I got to drive back to my office to get my credit card. Get the fuck out of here. Have you ever left your credit card at the office? No. I'd be freaking out if I left my credit. I'd be canceling my credit card if I left it at the office. Oh, my gosh. Anyway, I got a little sidetracked there. But, yes, I do think that that's a massive, massive component to it is fight or flight. No, it really isn't.

7:14 There's this element. Yeah. Going back in time, there was like this light bulb moment, you know, human needs psychology. You know, we've talked about this in other episodes before, but there's this dynamic of like these six human needs that we're trying to find creative ways, whether consciously or unconsciously. We're trying to find ways to satiate those six human needs, right? It's a survival mechanism. It's also, it gives us at an identity level, it gives us shape and form. Right. And so there's this piece when we look at what's happening in a sales conversation, the person who is most certain, the person who's, which is a fancy way of saying whoever's beliefs are stronger than the other person's beliefs.

7:58 They're the captain of the ship. So the real big question that pops up is. Are your beliefs about what you can do for your prospect stronger than their fear of why it won't work for them or their fear of whatever it is that's coming up for them showing itself as a limiting belief or showing itself as a objection, right? Because that's really all an objection is. It's a belief that has a weak energy around it. Therefore, they don't feel confident to take steps forward. Well, great. What have you done to build the muscle of certainty? What have you done to build your confidence? What have you done to really show up in that moment as a champion, as a commander, as a challenger, as somebody who's going to move that person forward versus letting them give in to the very thing that's probably why they're on the phone with you in the first place?

8:51 So true. And I think... You know, to that point, when we think about the whole limiting belief thing, I mean, stop as you're listening to this. Stop for a moment. I want you to think about a time in your life, whether it's recent or whether, you know, it's some time ago where you knew you needed to make a shift. You knew you needed to make a shift in your behavior. You knew you needed to make a shift in your identity. And I want you to think about that time and some of the hoops that you had to jump through mentally, emotionally, sometimes physically.

9:32 Yeah. to make that shift for yourself, right? Because here's the deal. When we're used to acting one way and we groove that pattern and then all of a sudden we interrupt it, that is not easy. Whether we're talking about like, you know, you cut down or cut out alcohol or sugar or you decided, I mean, try going exactly the same way to work every single day and then one way be like, oh, I'm going another way. Right. There's literally there's literal like mental, emotional, physical, sometimes discomfort. And once again, I think this is one of the things that that isn't considered when we get an objection is that someone is actually in a lot of cases trying to break their pattern.

10:22 And right then in that moment, it's just not as easy as just saying yes. It's so freaking true. It's funny because I remember back when I first heard that, you know, brush your teeth with your other hand. Like, you know how funky it feels. The other one is sleep on the other side of your bed and see how well you sleep, right? It's like we get so hardwired and conditioned to what feels our version of normal. And here's the reality. Every single time we have to make change in our behavior. And it's going to feel weird.

11:02 It's going to feel uncomfortable. And so there's actually, we had a client prospect this last week who in talking to her, she had some fear that came up around moving forward and actually coming into our mastermind, into our program. And she sent me a text message over the weekend and she goes, hey, I've got some trepidation. I'm kind of up in my head. I don't know what it is, but I'm afraid to move forward. And I was like, traditional sales would have been push, push, push, push, push. Right. And so what I sent back to her is I'm like, if I put myself in her shoes for a moment, like, what's the truth? I'm like, great question. And so my simple question back to her is I said, is it fear or is it danger?

11:49 Because I'm like, fear is something that we can help you move through. Fear is something we can hold your hand on the other side of fear. Guess what it is? It's fucking courage. It's joy. It's holy shit. I moved through that. I'm better. Danger. We got to pay heed to danger is I'm on the precipice of a cliff and I don't have a parachute on my back. If I fall, I might die. And so in sending her the question, just saying, Hey, let me ask you a quick question. Is it fear or is it danger? She wrote back. She goes, well, it's not danger. And I go, okay, so it's fear. So if you were in, so here's the quick piece. I go, if you were to move through it, who would you become?

12:30 She wrote back. She goes, sign me up. Let's go. Right. So I think there's this, this perception that when people have objections, again, is it fear? Is it danger? Do we have to push people through their objections? It's kind of like pushing somebody in the deep end versus navigating them through and them going, you know what? I can do this. And they jump in the deep end and they're stoked because they did it versus pissed that you push them in. At the end of the day, yeah, they're in the water, but how they feel in that water is Those are two different experiences. And this is why we see so many people like people who have really high conversion rates and really high cancellation rates. Ninety nine percent of the time, it's because they become a hammer in their objection. Yep. Johnny closer.

13:10 Yep. You got it. Well, and, you know, the other part is that when we start thinking about pushing people through it, um, If you're ever wondering like what actually makes you feel like the icky, slimy, pushy, you know, salesperson that so many of you are so deathly afraid of being, which is why you hate sales in the first place, uh, is that you, you know, put that connotation on it and, and the way that a lot of other people have acted to any of us, we've all probably had at least one experience like that. Um, It's because of the fact that you're missing the boat.

13:54 Yeah. So you're not addressing the real problem. And you're going upstairs and it's like, well, I got to think about, well, what exactly do you have to think about? Well, you know, listen, I just gave all of this to you on a silver platter. What, like, do you want to solve your problem or don't you? Right. In that moment. See, the interesting thing about this is is right in the moment that it's that it's happening. There's not awareness from the side of the prospect to understand what's going on inside of them in that moment. They're not going. I promise you in that moment, they're not going, wow, there's this pattern that I've had since I was like six.

14:38 Right. And fuck me if it isn't coming up right now. Wow. It's my shadow. They're not doing that. It's an unconscious behavior. But here's what's really interesting. By you ham-handedly trying to just cognitively, cerebrally deal with their objection, trying to logic your way through the situation or get pissed and just drop the hammer on them – Even though they don't understand in that moment what's going on subconsciously or they're not aware of it yet.

15:19 Yeah. That is the moment where it's very, very clear to people, whoa, this is not in alignment. Like whatever you just did and whatever I just did, uh-uh. We are not on the same page. This doesn't feel good. This feels icky. Now, don't push me. I don't like to be pushed, right? That's what's coming up in that moment because they don't understand what, you know, what's happening yet. They just know that something is off when you start pushing. Well, if we were to think of our prospects like children. Right. Like if we actually held them in that space, we would be we would behave very, very different.

16:05 And so one of the things that's kind of helped me through over the course of time is going, OK, they might not be a child in terms of how many years old they are. But whatever the thing is that I'm helping them with, they're in their infancy. Hence, the reason they don't have the muscle or the strength or the thing that they're trying to acquire by. coming to me to talk to me in the first place, right? Like they're an infant or they're a toddler, maybe perhaps that might be an easier one to put into the fold. And so what happens is when they bring up their fear, if you had a toddler who came to you and went, you know, daddy or mommy, I'm scared. Would you push back and go, what are you really scared about? What the hell are you scared about, kid? What do you mean you got to go talk to your priest and analyze this thing for 14 days before we can make a move?

16:49 Right? Like, no, we would hold their face and we'd go, it's okay. You can do this. We would... We would get on their level and we would not, we would show compassion and mercy, but we would also show that there's a higher part of their being that's capable. And I think that that's what happens so many times is we get into this judgment phase where we get pissed or we think that they told us our baby was ugly or like, yeah. we, we, we collapse or we contract. The other one that comes up is maybe we didn't give ourself enough time for the conversation. So we feel this pressure cooker of I've got to end this call. Cause I said it was 60 minutes and we're at 55 and they just gave me an objection. The end of the runway is going to be here and it's Thelma and Louise is about to happen. And like, we, we freak out.

17:31 Like what if time wasn't there? And what if the only thing that fucking mattered was the outcome, right? And what if it was life and death? And what if you truly saw them as a child? And what if you got on their level? And what if you grabbed their hand and said, I've got you? And you can do this versus you're a fucking idiot because you got to go talk to your spouse and you need to man up or you need to woman up or you need like, what do you mean? You don't have this on your credit card. You don't know what's on your credit. Like that's not, that's not objection handling. That's, I don't even know what that is. It's bad training over the course of time. Yeah. And it's, it's still rampant, which is just silliness.

18:14 I have a question for you personally. When was it that you... When did you really figure out like what was actually happening in objections? When did you move beyond the, okay, I got this book of shit to say when they say this one thing and really have some understanding? What was it that teed you up for that? It's interesting because there's two distinct quantum leap moments in my sales journey where I was like, I sucked. And then, ooh, I hit a new gear. The first one, and this is crazy. So when I was 18, I actually sold timeshares. Yeah. which I know anyone listening is going to be like, if you want to find the hardest thing on the planet to sell, if you can go cut your teeth on selling timeshare, holy moly.

19:02 The reason it's so hard is the mass majority of people selling it are selling it in a sleazy, slippery way because they don't know how to do it in an ethical and integritous capacity. And so when I got that job, it was wild. So I, my mentor is the one, he was their number one salesperson and he did sell in a very healthy, honest way, but he was like by far their number one producer. And he went and told him, he said, Hey, if you don't hire Brooke, I'm going to quit. because they didn't want to hire me. So I was like, just to give context, the next closest person in age to me was like 26 years older than me or something crazy. Like people my age at 18 did not go into the timeshare world.

19:43 So in going into that space, it was not a, it was not an easy sale. I didn't have much sales background. I had, I had waited tables, you know, prior to that. And so coming into selling timeshare, I'm like, what the heck? Well, they, they didn't have a whole heck of a lot to lose. So they gave me their what they would deem their lowest quality leads. And they're, they basically did it to pacify him with the intention of pushing me out, knowing that I wouldn't, I wouldn't perform. So my first two months I had zero sales. I made zero dollars. And so I was freaking out. Cause I'm like, what am I doing? I'm burning my time. I'm not making any money.

20:24 Like this is, this is brutal. Yeah. And something in my brain just went, what if everything you're doing is the opposite of what you should do? And I'm like, I got nothing to lose. I'm going to take this week's sales engagements. I'm literally going to do the opposite of every single thing that I've been coached to do. And instead of trying to push people in, I'm just going to tell them the truth. And I'm just going to walk them down the line of what it is that they want and see if there's an alignment and then just have a real conversation. And when the fears came up, instead of hammering back, I'm going to take a step back. And lo and behold, guess what happened in that third month?

21:04 blew out every single record they had. I went from making no money for two months and I made over $75,000 in one month at 18 years old. And my brain went, what the... But it came down to not pushing people. And there's, so maybe be clear on not pushing. There's times and place where people need to be pushed through their fear. But there's a big difference between pushing them in to your program. If you push them into your program, you're going to have to push them through your program. So... In that moment in time, I went, wow, okay, there's a different side of psychology here that's at play and how I can play this game that serves versus sells.

21:47 So that was like my first quantum leap. That one was more out of necessity because I knew I'm going to lose my job. So I'm like, I was like reckless abandon. I got nothing to lose. The next one was more... It was slightly different, not slightly different, it's way different. So Ryan, I know you know this story, but I know our audience probably hasn't heard this one. So in my first week selling for Tony Robbins, so this was straight, you know, over the phone selling coaching. The way it was positioned was you get a free one-on-one coaching session. So it was like a value add session that then moved into, hey, imagine where your life could be if you had these types of calls, you know, on the regular.

22:28 And so at that moment in time, we were in the physical office down in San Diego. There was about, I don't know, there's about 120 people on the sales floor, cubicle spaces, you know, what you think of in terms of a sales organization. And I got this guy who came on the phone and he goes, Brooke, before we start today's call, I need you to know that I have a gun on my lap. And depending on where this call goes, it's going to determine whether or not I pull the trigger. He goes, I've tried everything. I've been on every medication. I've been in therapy for 20 years. What do you got? And at the moment, back then, no pressure at all.

23:09 No pressure. And full transparency, I didn't have anybody to like lean on or be like phone a friend. Like, you know, what do I do? Like there was no, there was none of that. And so I had to shift gears immediately from selling this person into coaching to, And back then, by the way, like we didn't have like an 800 number of where we could send this person to being like, hey, I actually can't help. Like, what am I going to do? Go tough luck. Like, go call somebody else. Like I couldn't. I was it was a moment in time where I had to show up as a different human being. I had to show up as a different man. I had to show up as a warrior. I had to show up as somebody that was so certain that this guy is not going to pull the trigger.

23:53 Which was totally different than showing up so certain that I'm going to enroll this guy in coaching. Right? And so the objection handling in my head was no longer like, what card are you going to put that on? It went from... What's happening in this moment? What is the outcome? There's one way. And like, I had literally at the moment I hit mute and I out loud, everyone's on the sales floor there. Out loud, I went, God, give me the words to serve this person right now. And I kicked my chair back and I stood up and I took the mute off and I went, here's what's gonna happen. Like, and I just, I stepped into a different identity. There was no objections that dude could give me that I wasn't ready to just freaking hit out of the park and incinerate.

24:39 Right. Because I stepped into this new mode, which was not about what am I offering? Is it right for them? Like, is it the right time? Do they need it? Am I going to sit there and go, oh, I think you should go talk to somebody about it? No. Like, here is the outcome. Let's go. And I think that that's oftentimes where we get into the space of playing it safe and playing it nice versus having a real conversation that has those types of stakes at play. And so after that call, I printed out on a piece of paper, it said, this client's life depends on this call. And for 20 years, I've anchored that into my brain that every single engagement I have is something that God or the universe, whatever you call him or her, they've put that person in front of me for a divine reason.

25:25 And I've also conditioned this muscle of give me your objections, give me your fears, give me your limitations, and I'll give you results. Right? So I've conditioned this new belief of I welcome the objections. I welcome those limiting beliefs because I want to fucking destroy them so that I can help you get to where you want to go because that's the only thing standing in the way. Right? So it's very different than traditional sales, which is like, here's how you speak to it. Yeah, whatever. Anyways, that was my monologue for the day. No, it's so true. And I think, you know, in a completely different environment, you know, I – it's funny because that was one of my first sales jobs too.

26:06 It wasn't timeshares, but similar environment and equally as challenging for a number of different reasons. Now, I was selling – I was selling travel packages that people – it was one of those deals where I don't even think they do this anymore. I mean I do know that like Hilton and Marriott will do this kind of stuff. But people would get a deal in the mail where – They basically get this certificate and, you know, these pamphlets and stuff. And it would be like, congratulations, you know, on winning, you know, I forget the wording, but it was basically look like you won a vacation.

26:50 And so, of course, it's like, oh, yeah, let's go. I'm getting on the phone. I'm calling these people. Yeah. And it was, you know, five days and four nights in Cancun or, you know, four days and three nights in Fremont, Bahamas, Nassau. And... It was a very, very difficult sales environment because some people were smart enough to actually read the entire thing and realize that, yes, you were selling something. It was at a huge discount. It was like $199, you know, or $249 for like five days, four night vacation at a decent, you know, resort.

27:37 Wow. But you still had to sell it and you started to get past people getting pissed off when they didn't read the fine print and realize they didn't win anything. It wasn't their lucky day. But I didn't – that environment for me wasn't conducive to me learning the things that you're talking about right now. I didn't figure that out then. Yeah. I got good at, you know, at good enough at what I did. But it wasn't until I got more into relationship selling that that I really started to understand that at a much deeper level where I was going out literally, you know, when I'm in oil and gas, you know, cold calling people that have never seen me before.

28:23 They have no idea who I am. I'm out in the middle of rural America. City boy. Yeah. out in the middle of rural America and having to knock on people's doors and see if I can get them to let me into their house. Here's another thing, you guys. You people that think this is difficult, get the fuck out of here right now. Try going to rural America where nobody knows who you are, you don't talk like them, you don't look like them, you don't dress like them, you don't drive the cars they drive. You pull up in their driveway, knock on their door and ask to go in their house. Yeah, let me in your house and let me have a conversation with you.

29:05 But what I learned from that, it was so interesting because the dynamic of that, In a lot of cases, I was there in on a technical level is really interesting engagement because on a technical level, it was I was buying something from them. But I had to sell in order to buy what I wanted to buy from them. There was no, you know, I don't sell and then I just get what I want. Doesn't work that way. So there were so many situations. Some of you are listening to this right now, and you've no doubt had lots of situations where you're going, my God, can't you see all the good that this would do you? Why don't you just say yes?

29:48 Guys, I have been in people's living rooms that have very little. I mean – Very little. They've got land. They have a very, very simple house. In some cases, it's in disrepair. They have needs out the wazoo for their family. And I'm offering them a check for $150,000, $200,000. And they're not immediately saying yes. And initially, I'd never had that experience. And it was like, wait a minute, what is wrong with you? And then I learned that, you know, the more I just got anchored into the idea of questioning, I learned what was really behind the no or the I don't know yet or I got to think about it or, you know, give me a week or whatever.

30:42 Yeah. I learned what was really behind that. And what was very eyeopening for me is actually carrying on. I was the kind of guy who would carry on relationships. I care about people and I like making relationships. And when I spend time with people, especially a lot of time, we make a big deal. I don't drop off the face of the earth. I had people calling me fucking 10, 15 years after I did something with them. And yeah, I can't tell you how many times I made a great relationship with somebody and, and had them tell me after the fact, Ryan, this is what I, this is why it took me a while, you know, to, to say, yes, this is what was really going on in the background.

31:23 And then it was like, Oh my God. Oh, you weren't just being an asshole in that moment, you know? And so I think that, and the thing about it is to your point, when I figured that out, I was unstoppable. It was one of those deals where I was like, I had moments where even when I wasn't doing it all that often, you know, I had upwards of 200 people working for me. We had times where... We had a really big deal or deals that had to get done in order for us to kind of complete a project, that kind of thing. It wasn't getting done. It wasn't getting done. Just give me the damn thing and let me go handle it. And it didn't come from me being Johnny Closer. It came from me really understanding how to make relationships with people, ask better questions to truly understand what was going on, and then find a way to bridge the gap from where they were to where they really wanted to go.

32:18 Um, so different experience, but have you seen that YouTube, but the, the guy who's, he's on the street and he's, you know, he's doing his, his content creation stuff, but he's got a one ounce of gold coin in one hand and he's got the a hundred grand chocolate bar in the other hand. I have not seen this now. Oh dude, you got to see this. So he's going up to strangers and he's like, you can pick one and it's totally up to you. He's like, I've got this one ounce gold bar. Right. And I've got this hundred grand chocolate bar. Dude, 98% took the chocolate bar. And it goes to show people's beliefs are fear first.

33:03 There's certainty. Well, that thing's in a wrapper. It's probably safe for me to eat. That thing's probably fake gold. So they would rather take the thing that gives them certainty, a 68 cent chocolate bar versus a $10,000 piece of gold. Right. So that's such a rad story that you had in terms of back in the day. It's like here you're coming in with literally hundreds of thousands of dollars. And it's like, let me think about it. Even though they're down and out. And even though they're, it's like... what? Because logic doesn't, it's not a logical thing. It's a survival thing. And I love that you, I love that you have that experience because it gave you a muscle like nobody's business.

33:46 Yeah. Well, you know, the other thing about it that was really interesting is that it, it, it also showed to your point, even though many of these people, not all by the way, but so many people that I ended up doing business with over the years had so little Certainty. If I say yes to you, I am not confident that, you know, I'm uncertain whether I'm going to get to preserve what really matters to me. And, you know, this is a really big thing because you could sit here and go, my God, I don't understand. Why wouldn't you take this money for crying out loud?

34:27 You could sell your farm and go buy another one, you know, at that point. Well, you know, it doesn't quite work that way. And we have to read between the lines and ask great questions to understand what really does matter to people. I want to ask a question because we're going to start to run a little short on time. And I think this is... one that we can dig in on with the time that we have left very quickly here, but why not just come up with a list of stuff to say? I mean, every other, every fricking sales program on the face of the earth has got say this, say that, say this, say that. Why is that not effective?

35:07 So you're a married man. I am. Right. So, actually, by the way, congratulations, because you just had a big anniversary this last week. I did. 19 years. Yeah. Woo-wee. So, I'm going to wager that part of you being married for 19 years has a lot to do with your capacity to handle objections. Yeah. Fair. And here's what I mean by that. If your wife came home and said she was frustrated about something, and if you went into rote memorization as to why are you upset about that? Why don't you just move through that? Like, if that's how you played, my guess is you'd probably be buried in the ground somewhere back in middle America. Yeah. 19 years ago, right? So there's this piece of when we go into rote memorization, people can feel that our authenticity is not there.

35:53 They can feel that it's an act. They can feel that it's not truth. It might, and actually it could, it could even be truth, but it's delivered in a way. It's like it's packaged in this untrue box. And again, it's the hundred grand chocolate bar versus the gold, the gold bar. Right. they're receiving it in a way that's like, it doesn't feel right. Or it might feel completely disjointed where you had this heartfelt conversation all the way up. And then you go Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Mrs. Hyde, and you flip into rote memorization. And it's like, wait, what? And that momentary lapse of this is not the same person as 10 seconds ago. That's the saber tooth tiger. Something in my environment just changed. It doesn't feel safe. Okay. And that's what rote memorization is.

36:34 And actually just, it's a different context, but I think it makes sense here. We have a client who just ran her first event this last week. And she worked with a speaking coach. She had her entire, dude, she's crazy. She's crazy awesome. Crazy in the sense that she had every part of her two and a half day event scripted out. Woo. Bro. eight hour days, every piece scripted, written out. And I'm like, you're crazy. You're legit crazy. And I told her point blank. I go, I'm going to just give you words of encouragement here. I know your speaking coach is going to want you to do it their way, which is totally cool. However, there's going to be a point, probably about 45 seconds into when you start that it's all going to go away and you're going to get this tunnel vision and you're going to step into truth.

37:23 Yeah. And the difference is they're going to feel rote memorization versus you being authentic and they're just serving. And why we don't like rote memorization, again, it's not say this one thing every single time it's going to give you a guaranteed. Here's the crazy part, bro. We as people who are trying to enroll or sell, we're asking for the same thing that our clients are asking for. We're saying I need certainty that if I do this thing, it's going to work. And it's the very thing that your clients are saying of, tell me that thing that's going to give me certainty that it's going to work. Like we're in an inferior position when we go into rote memorization versus stepping into this whole position of strength of what is the truth that person needs to hear in that moment in time that's going to move them forward.

38:11 You just said it. I mean, that truly sums it up is that every single human being is completely different. All of their patterns are completely different. Everything they've been through is completely different. Everything that they want is completely different. Everything that they need is completely different. And yet you think that going into a book and reading that one line that somebody said to you that one time is going to be the game changer. Nope. Nope. Now, the one thing that I will say to this as like a small caveat, I think that over time, when you... When you hear other people actually doing this from a heart-centered space, can you pick up things that you can then weave into conversations later on down the road?

39:01 Hell yes, you can. Oh, yeah. Of course you can. But that is completely different from you just gave me this one objection. And literally, like back in – I don't know if you ever had one of these, but, you know, back in when I was selling the travel stuff, I literally had a book and I used to flip through it feverishly because like for each objection, I had like little tabs and I was like, oh, shit, let me get to that one. Oh, you know, so it's so not that, though. And it's not fucking flashcards and it's not any of that nonsense. It's being present in the moment. Yeah. And the more tools you put in your toolbox that you can then call on in the right moment, the more effective that kind of stuff is actually going to be because it's going to come from not, oh my God, I have to say this thing.

39:51 It's a heartfelt reaction that is then taken in exactly that way as well. So... Yeah. The power is in preparation, not the prescription. Right. If that makes sense. So it's like, yeah, come up with all the things and get your head wrapped around it. Come up with the language, go, you know, do the work. However, if you do it as a prescription, it's very static and it's very heady and not heart centered. So, yeah. Well said. Well said. So, my man, I think we – let's wrap there. This is probably a huge mindset shift for many of you right now. Go back and listen to this episode several times because here's the deal.

40:34 I want to circle back to the way that I opened the episode. It is not about – what exactly do I say? How do I handle the objection? It's about understanding it at its root and then really getting good at listening and being able to speak from the heart when it's needed. That's what this is all about at the end of the day. You want to drastically improve your closing percentage, your sales revenue, and you want to change a whole lot more lives. Start here. Obsess over this. And I promise you it'll be absolutely life-changing. You're Brooke, thank you for all this dude. It was so, so, so good. So much value in today's episode, bro. Really good stuff. Ditto, my friend. Ditto, ditto. That was a dope episode.

41:15 Thank you, thank you. All right, thank you for listening to this episode of the Coaching Equation Podcast. Until next time, be well. Take care. Thank you for listening to this episode of The Coaching Equation. Please hit subscribe wherever you listen to your podcasts. And if you got value out of this episode, we would be so grateful if you would share it out with a friend and leave us a review on iTunes or your favorite platform. To learn more about Empire Partners or to inquire about working with Ryan and Brooke, please visit www.empirepartners.io forward slash go.