Why Great Leaders Must Lead Themselves First

0:01 Being great at what you do doesn't automatically make you great at business. The skills that got you here won't get you there. This is Path to Mastery, the raw and real business podcast for service-based entrepreneurs, consultants, and practitioners ready to stop chasing tactics and start building foundations that scale. Hosted by Ryan Lang and Brooke Bishop, co-founders of Empire Partners. Let's dive in. Welcome back to the Path to Mastery podcast. I'm your host, Ryan Lang, CEO and co-founder of Empire Partners. And I got Natalie Hunter with me today. What's going on, girl? Hey. Oh, man. This is so fun. First of all, it was such a pleasure to have you and your amazing husband, Michael, who's also been on this podcast at our event this past March.

0:52 Was so fun and such a powerful event. It was fantastic, and you guys really helped make it even more fantastic. I... I want to really dig in on something though today. This will be such a great extension of that because, you know, when we're together at events, we're... And most of the people watching this show are leaders in some capacity. Most are business owners, small business owners, solopreneurs. They're leading teams. They are leading their clients. They are, in many cases, leading their families.

1:32 And... And I think, you know, Brooke and I have spent a lot of time recently talking about leadership. And I want to kind of go, there's so many different routes we can go with you because you're so incredibly talented. But if it's cool with you, I'd love to head down that path because I know you've got some really insightful frameworks around that and things that I think will really help people on that. So you game? Absolutely. Right on. Let me ask you this. First of all, what do you feel like, especially right now? I think you and I are both of the opinion that we're in a really interesting space energetically right now in the world. What do you feel like is missing from a leadership standpoint?

2:17 I think what's missing in this exciting time as consciousness is rising, I think what's missing is leaders taking the time to get really honest with themselves about their skills, about their own energy. Safe spaces, I feel like, are very much needed for leaders as well. A space where you are not in leadership mode. You are away from the people that you're leading so that you can... have a mirror held up for you and do the deep work to dig into what's happening for you. You know, we see, and this is also human nature, but we see a lot of leaders who are very externally focused on the team. A lot of my clients come in and they're like, the team's not doing this right.

2:59 The team isn't operating in this particular way. And at the end of the day with love, it does come back to the leader's energy, the leader's skill set, the leader's vision and ability to hold that role for the people that they are leading. I love that. And I think it's you have such an interesting perspective on this because of the different roles that you've held. I mean, long time and getting back to it, by the way, which I'm super excited about. Professional speaker, you know, coach to high achievers, impact makers, business owners, entrepreneurs and.

3:42 And. I had what you said is really interesting because you talked about it starting with self. And I think that a lot of times we mistake leadership, regardless of the way that we're doing it as well. I'm essentially I'm I'm I'm I'm sort of wrangling other people, so to speak. I hear that a lot wrangling cats. Yeah. Wrangling the team. I hear that. I hear that word a lot. How can we... What is a simple beginning to understanding how we stop trying to just wrangle others and start internal first?

4:25 Well, I do like to break it down into the four pillars of transformational leadership is what I call it, which is really the ability to be that positive ripple and transform your team and impact your team. Not just influence your team, but impact your team so that they are also operating at their highest level, their highest level of consciousness, their highest level of their own internal standard. And the four pillars are first vision, you know, holding that vision for your people, but also for yourself. You'd be surprised how many times we come into a session and people are sitting at a very negative and low viewpoint of the team and of what's happening to yes, also of self, but really totally, you know, what's happening and kind of not giving the team the benefit of the doubt.

5:20 And so holding a higher level of vision, because if your team, even if your team's not operating the way that you want them to, there's always a reason for it. And I help our leaders understand that, that there's a reason that this is happening. And if we can unlock that reason and we can understand and maybe even validate that reason, even if it's not what you want them to be doing. Right. it's going to shift the behavior. It's going to shift that, that the way that that person is holding onto and creating that behavior. So first elevating your vision is the first pillar. I want to say, we'll, we'll, we'll come back to the last three. I want to ask a question though, because I think, you know, I was having a conversation with somebody recently about business and, and psych and psychology and energy.

6:06 And the statement was made, well, You first have to be able to actually cast that vision. Right. So let me ask a question because I know I'll speak for myself. Forget about other people for a moment. There have certainly been times where I feel like I've been a very powerful vision caster. And then there have been times where I feel like I've lost that vision to some degree. Right. If we get, if we find ourselves in a place and a lot of times I, I don't know how you feel about this, but I actually put somewhat of a connection between vision and purpose to some degree.

6:48 And I think that when we get to those spaces, sometimes where we're just grinding it out, where we're just doing the work, where it's 80 hour work weeks and everything. you know, we're looking around going, wait a minute, what have I built of my life here? And maybe we've lost that vision a little bit, or maybe even we've just, you know, we've just kind of gotten a bit off track. How do we sort of recenter and recalibrate and get back to being the powerful vision creators that all of us are naturally? Well, I think it goes back to my first answer is making sure that you have a space, too, for you, where you can check in, where you can come back to center, where you can connect not just with the vision, but your mission in that vision.

7:37 You know, we just talked about this with our personal brand clients the other day around their vision for the world, their vision for humanity. but also what is your purpose in that vision? And we have to stay in touch with that. We have to stay in touch with our own part in, in the greater playing of humanity right now. And again, so often we, we lose touch for so many reasons. There's, the kind of design of human nature with our eyes looking outward first. We don't look inward first. We look outward first for the problem. We look outward first at distractions. And we allow that to tell us the current state of where we are.

8:18 Yes. Rather than inside first and inside out. Yep. Not as well said. Okay. So pillar number two. Pillar number two is your energy and your frequency. So first vision, which is important to cast for the vision of the company. I work with a lot of leaders, companies, industry disruptors. This is, you know, for people who are entrepreneurs. This is also for people who are coaches to holding that high vision. And then also having your energy be at a high frequency. Yeah. And I always say, too, you've got to do the clean out of your own house if you're going to help people clean theirs, too. You know, pointing finger at someone else.

9:00 You've got how many fingers pointing back at you. Right. That is it's important to remember that that you are creating also with your energy and your vibration. Yes. People are responding to your energy and your vibration, whether you know it or not. This is actually like 90% of the conversations I have with my private clients. Your energy and your ripple is what is creating that response. So if you're operating out of fear, they're going to feel it. If you're operating out of anger and resentment, they're going to feel that, etc., etc. I love that you bring this up because I can't tell you how many times, you know, in a consulting capacity, I have been working with a business owner, a leader, an entrepreneur who is running around like a bull in a China shop, you know, energetically way out of alignment.

9:50 And then pretty much just bitching and moaning about what the team is doing or not doing or whatever. And, you know, um, yeah, I think I love that you, I love that you bring that up. And I think obviously if we can't, again, I mean, you know what's powerful about this? I think oftentimes in life in general, I think in business, this is true as well. We get in these situations where we feel like we don't have control of things. Well, the first two that you just talked about, we have total control over. And that gives me peace at the end of the day. Absolutely. I don't know. Yeah. Okay. Love that. Number three. Number three is your skill set.

10:31 So understanding there's actually a skill to helping someone change their behavior. You know, most of the time people come at it with trying to just tell somebody to do something different. But the behavioral change process for humans involves a lot of different components. And when you understand that as a leader, you can ask the right questions, you can give the right guidance, and you can support somebody in unlocking their own next level and what it is that you want them to do with a lot more ease and a lot less resistance. And that all comes down to your skill set. So the way that we have it too is we teach it like a set of glasses is what I call.

11:12 So you put on this set of glasses, you can see where somebody is in the transformational process of the behavior that you're wanting them to change. Sometimes they need help to actually see the problem differently. Sometimes they need help to feel the impact that it's actually having on themselves or the team or whatever is happening within the environment. the dynamic of the company. And all these different factors increase someone's own desire to change it. So then they tip into the willingness to actually do it. And that goes for any type of behavior change. And I train coaches on this as well to ask the right questions and support their people in changing for themselves.

11:52 But leaders knowing how to do this for their team, for their company, for their community also creates a highly productive dynamic within the organization. I agree. Would you, would you connect that? Would you call that influence the end of the day? Within that context, I would because you're trying to get them. Well, in a company context, I would because you're trying to get them to change their behavior for a certain outcome for the greater good of the company, whatever the company's outcomes are in a more of a coaching side of things. they are coming up with their own answers, their own desires.

12:32 They're operating within their own frameworks and their own goals. So it's a little bit different. I do when it comes to the difference between influence and impact, I do talk about influence being, you know, trying to lovingly persuade somebody to have a certain outcome that you desire for them. But impact is a little bit less, It's attached. It's a little bit more just kind of letting the light do what the light needs to do for somebody and being a little more detached from how that ends up showing itself in their life. So with more of a coaching framework is really when I, where I teach that you're not trying to get them to do anything for you, but for a leader of a company, it's a little different.

13:14 You know, though, I think like I'm already connecting dots between the first two and the third one, though, as it relates to impact, because if you're going to empower people, whether they're your clients or whether there are people on your team to go out and actually, you know, lead themselves, which ultimately, why would we not want that as leaders? You know, that's more freedom for us. It's more freedom for them. It enhances creativity. But we can't, there's no way we can effectively allow people to lead themselves if we are not internally aligned first. So it makes complete sense. I'm curious about something because you have one of the things that I've loved talking to you about is your journey in terms of you know, really, really understanding coaching and process and that skill set.

14:07 I'm curious in all of your journeys through this, because it's been, you know, a pretty epic journey for you on that front. What were some of the things that led you to actually create your own certification program? Because, I mean, listen, there are plenty of them out there. So why did the world need another one? And what was, you know, what was kind of the nuance that you went, oh, this is missing and we got to people need to know? Yeah, it's a great question. I started my career as a speaker back in 2004. So I first stepped on a stage, was paid to impact this audience. And that's when I say I really started to study energy because when you're sent into a group of thousands of people and you have to show up and get a result, get them to decide to make some positive changes for themselves, you figure out really quickly energy and energy shifts and things like that.

15:05 About four or five years later, I found my first spiritual teacher. And that's when I really started to do my own inner work, had my spiritual awakening. I actually had gotten laid off from that job when the market crashed in 2008. And that was also when I decided to go out and become an entrepreneur because schools were still calling me, people were still wanting me to speak. And I was like, I guess I can do this on my own. I found my first teacher at that same time. So next level of awakening was happening for me as I was doing the inner work and also creating an outer impact. And I had my ups and my downs with my career, my national speaking career. And it was around 2017. I got a lot of requests. My impact was at its next level.

15:46 I had transformed my own energy. I was starting to get requests to be working with people one-on-one after I'd speak. People were like, can I hire you? And I was like, hire me for what? I need to figure out... what kind of a skillset I want to have here. So I looked into different programs, ended up going to one of the most conscious coaching schools that I could find at the time. And I remember sitting in this coaching school watching a coaching demo. And it was, you know, a successful coaching conversation demo that we were supposed to be watching. And it was in person. So I was there, I could feel everybody in person. And I remember thinking to myself, that guy's just saying different words. His energy hasn't actually shifted.

16:27 So he's not going to change his behavior. He's not going to do anything differently after this. He's just saying what he wants to happen, but he's not actually aligned to it. I knew it based on all of my study, all of my work with my spiritual teacher, and then, of course, my career. I didn't say anything at the time. I just clocked it. And I was in my own... I started my own business, and I was launching my own coaching business. I was really in it, working with amazing clients. And then two years later, I got a call saying, from one of my clients. And it was just very weird because normally my clients met me on Zoom. They didn't actually ever get me on the phone, but my phone rang and it was a client and she was just yelling excitedly. She was a coach as well. And she said, Natalie, the way I have to tell you, the way that you coach me is making me a better coach to my clients.

17:12 And I was like, oh, that's great. And she goes, no, no, no, you're not hearing me. She said, the way you're coaching me is very different than anything I've experienced. And I think you have a modality here. I think you have something here. And I said, OK. She said, pay attention. Just pay attention to what you're doing. That's what I'm supposed to tell you. And I said, OK, thank you. hung up the phone and I did. I started to pay attention to my coaching conversations and I was noticing like there's the same eight things that I'm doing, seeing, saying, like I started to realize I have a, I do have a methodology here and slowly, but surely my coach training downloaded in. And then in early 2020, I ended up running my very first coaching cohort.

17:54 I just figured it out. I was, you know, talking to a few clients. I was like, Hey, do you want to learn how to do what I do? And they were like, yes, yes, yes. And I built it to be an ICF accredited organization because I knew that was going to be, you know, a standard that I wanted to meet. So over the next two years, I really built this this program in that way and also, you know, had those standards in mind. So I was able to get it. ICF accredited and it became the first ICF accredited energy coaching training of its kind. And it was really, again, just the coaching skill set paired together with everything I knew about energy, transformation, personal growth, and working with that light inside of you to shift someone's energy.

18:37 And that's really what you can feel in the coaching conversations now through all of my trained coaches. You can feel that moment when the energy shifts for that person, the awareness changes. We've been doing some studying on the science behind it, kind of the chemicals that are getting released in the brain, the neuroplasticity that's accessible then for the behavior change to last. And it really catalyzes a very strong energy shift in a person when we approach it the way that we do. I love this because I think that right now, I mean, at this point, everyone's a coach. Everybody's a coach.

19:19 And even if you've had some training, and I can't even fault people for this, you know, it's like, well, I don't know. Well, what if you did know? Then what? You know, that's pretty much where we're going, right? But I think it's why I love what you do. And I've seen it up close and personal multiple times. And there is a palpable energy, energetic shift. And and that I think right now is is desperately, desperately, desperately needed because people don't just need to talk to somebody. They need someone who's actually capable of assisting them and shifting that energy at the end of the day.

20:01 Yeah, very much so. And that's really what I think this next level of humanity is going to be asking of us, especially with AI kind of taking over in the way it is. People are going to be craving more of that human to human connection and real change at the end of the day, not just some well-written marketing copy. You know, people are going to want real results. Yes, I love that. Okay. Number four, number, number four, number four, pillar, number four of the transformation of transformational leadership pillars is scale. So it's understanding a, uh, the ripple that your light is sending out and having a way to scale it either through the company or through your business or your business model that personal brand.com.

20:45 We really support our clients in creating the business model behind their personal brand so they can get paid so they can truly scale And having a solid plan in place for your light and for your impact really makes it sustainable for you at the end of the day. So you can make a living doing this. And then for our entrepreneurs that have companies and teams that they work with too, we have other ways to support them in quantifying the impact that their employees are having on each other and on your clients from that ripple outward from the company too. But knowing that light is meant to keep going, you know, the impact, the energy impact that you have on someone else doesn't stop with just you.

21:29 It continues to move through you to the world. I love that you bring this up because I think that, you know, we come in contact with so many people who've done a lot of inner work and many of them are in a very good energetic space. And. Some it's heartbreaking to watch because they haven't been able to understand the vehicle to go spread that further, you know, and that I think is so important that you bring that up. And it's one of the reasons that I love doing stuff with you and Michael and Jonathan at personal brand.com, because we're so aligned that way. Like, you know, you can, you can have a vehicle and be totally energetically out of alignment and then I go work.

22:14 Um, or, um, You know, you can be in energetic alignment, not have the vehicle, and then you're stuck without the scale that people really need. So that's absolutely beautiful. And I think it's important here. So... I want to look at this. We have, there are multiple ways that I think this is applicable and you touched on both of them, which is from a true leadership perspective inside of your company, whether you're a leader of one or two or 20. And as a practitioner, if you are coaching, I, you know, I think it's applicable. So tell us a little bit about the coach training and how from, you know, from a skillset perspective, How could we get involved or learn from you in terms of understanding how we can level that up?

23:08 Awesome. Well, I want to circle back to one thing that you were just talking about, about the personal brand. We really take a full bodied, full, whole human approach to building a personal brand now at personalbrand.com because your light, your personal brand is you. So people are going to feel you. And we talk about your brand, your, your brand messaging and your brand imaging. I thought it was just a website. We talk about it as the vehicle. We talk about as the outside of the car. People see the paint. People see the make and model of the car, right? It's the thing that they see that drives by and they're like, oh, that's pretty good. The engine is the thing that makes it go, which is what Michael teaches. The business model, the structure behind your personal brand. How do you make money? And then I do the being. We call it the brand, the business and the being.

23:48 And the being is the person who's got their foot on the gas. Yeah. You can put your foot on the gas, or you can put your foot on the brake. But we need all three to be in place. So like you said, somebody can be energetically in alignment, but missing the vehicle, right? You can have a great idea, but if you don't have the business model behind it, you're not going to make an impact in the way that you want to. So brand the business and the being is what we really cover at personalbrand.com. We've got our workshops. We've got our brand and business breakthrough workshop. And what we're adding on now... is my coach training. We're bringing it back to help support, to help support people in creating a transformational personal brand. So your brand is not just, you know, you, it's also the impact that you're able to have and create.

24:33 And people are going to be craving transformational impact in this next era. They're going to be craving real change and, and to, to get those dream testimonials and to, to get those, those people raving about you and your brand. Yeah. take some skill. So we're going to do an event in October, which is going to technically be our coach training level one, but it'll be a three and a half, four day event, transformational leadership training. And it will be a lot of the skills that we talk about and giving people the opportunity to do a little bit inner work and do that vibrational raising for yourself as a leader. So this is for coaches or practitioners, business owners, It's also for people who lead a team or lead a community to really help them take their skills to the next level as well in creating impact for the people that you are that are on the receiving end of you and your light.

25:31 I love this. And I've, you know, I've been at your guys events. I know how you pour into people. This is going to be super cool. And I just want to say as, as you know, I, you guys are good friends. And as somebody who is just enamored with what you do and how you show up and the light that you radiate. I'm so excited for the people that haven't gotten a chance to get impacted by you in this way, to, you know, be impacted by you with the coach training and all of that stuff. Because, I mean, it is a true gift and something unlike I've seen before. So I think it's fabulous. That means a lot. And I can't wait for this. That means a lot. You've seen so much.

26:11 That means a lot coming from you. Thank you. Yeah. You're it's well-deserved. So if, if somebody is interested in this, if they want to connect with you, what's the best way for them to get in touch? Yep. Natalie Hunter live on social media platforms. You can send me a DM. Let me know. We'll, we'll have ways to sign up for the trainings too. We've got our events coming up. Personal brand.com slash breakthrough has our next brand and business breakthrough details in September. And you can reach me at nataliehunterlive.com as well. Right on. You are amazing gal. Thank you for being here. Thank you for sharing your light with us today. And I can't wait to do it again. Thank you for having me. Awesome. Thank you for listening to this episode of the Path to Mastery podcast.

26:51 Until next time. Take care. Thanks for listening to the Path to Mastery podcast. If you got value from this, leave us a review and subscribe so that you never miss a single episode. And if you know another entrepreneur who needs to hear this, do us a solid and send it their way. We'll catch you next time on the Path to Mastery podcast.